Contribute
Register

4K With Skylake - Possible Without Graphics Card?

Status
Not open for further replies.
OK, another question: Do all the recommended mother boards support the 4k @ 60Hz.
Once again, I do not see that in the specs.

And what was warned to me, I might want to go with a DP as the HDMI 1.4 is not widely available in today's monitors.
For example:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00PC9HFNY/?tag=tonymacx86com-20

It appears that this 4k monitor has only DP connectivity.

Or is it worth it to search for a monitor with HDMI 1.4 connectivity?
 
In your BIOS, Peripherals, is IGFX set as your initial graphics?
In your BIOS, Chipset, is Internal Graphics enabled?
They both were.
Moreover I checked:
DVMT Pre-allocated: was 64M, I set it to 512M
DVMT Total Gfx Mem: was [Max] and I let it so.
To no avail.

What does the resolution look like if you boot from a Linux Live-CD or Linux Live-USB? Can you change the resolution to 4K?
What does the resolution look like under Windows and after you have installed the Intel video driver(s)?
I am afraid I don't have a Linux install and I have only an XP license and there is no way I'll try installing Linux. The whole project was to save time while working and if I just want to recoup the time I lost only trying to make this thing run honestly I'll have to do at least 10 years of hard work. It's still staying idle on the floor.

If you can, what happens if your re-run Clover and save the plist to the HDD, after enabling video?
Is there an Intel video driver that you can enable in Clover or MultiBeast?, say with a different MAC ID?
I only have pages with stuff that mean nothing to me and I prefer to touch nothing I am not sure of. The Help doesn't really help me.

The only reasonable move to date is to give up the plan of getting a decent image out of the mobo and to buy a GPU. Just hoping it'll yet another pain in the neck.

Nick
 
You can burn a Linux LIVE-CD or create a Linux Live-USB. You would boot off of it and you would NOT install Linux. Ubuntu and Mint Linux both have Live CD/USB you can download and create, as do a lot of other distros. Linux is a world onto itself, so you may want to stick with a MATE version as it is easier to navigate around. If you know XP you won't have too much problem navigating Linux.

https://livecdlist.com/

You can even get one just for GParted. Hopefully one of those distros will allow you to change monitor resolution, which is really all you want to test. But a LiveCD is a great tool to have.

If you're not tech savvy building a Hackintosh could be a little overwhelming. But there are other things just as overwhelmng - working with UEFI, getting SSDs to work correctly, installing and setting up Linux, setting up a Kodi box with repositories, setting up wireless access points and securing it correctly, etc. Heck, I curse a lot when navigating around in Windows 10... My next user name is going to be "Alt-F4"...

Refresh rates with 4K panels are also somewhat of a concern. A number of the more affordable 4K displays currently on the market offer only 30Hz refresh rates. The typical refresh rate of a mainstream display is 60Hz, and fast gaming-monitors can offer as high as 144Hz. Although some would argue that 30Hz is fast enough for video and image editing, the user experience with a 30Hz display can be nauseating. Mouse and window movements are jerky, and the smoothness we’ve all become accustomed to using 60Hz (or faster) displays goes right out the window. Stick to a 60Hz or higher display if at all possible.

Another oddity with many 4K PC monitors is that they’re recognized as dual displays, each with resolutions of 1920x2160. Many of the most recently released 4K displays feature newer internal scalers than can handle true 4K resolutions. Older tiled displays required dual scalers and need to be connected to a system via two HDMI or DisplayPort cables, or by using a single DisplayPort cable paired with graphics card that could support a feature called MST, or multi-stream transport—all this to achieve a 4K resolution with a 60Hz refresh rate.

While MST was a clever way to get around an early hurdle with 4K displays, the technology can act pretty wonky when you’re using software designed to appear only on one screen in a multi-monitor environment—the menus in PC games are one glaring example. Look for a monitor supporting single-stream transport and true 4K resolutions instead.

HDMI is trickier: While some 4K monitors support HDMI, the version of HDMI supported by most graphics cards—HDMI 1.4—locks 4K output at a choppy 30Hz. The newer HDMI 2.0 spec supports a full 60Hz at 4K resolution, assuming both your monitor and your graphics card support it. Nvidia’s new 900-series graphics cards support HDMI 2.0. In general, however, it’s easier to drive a 4K monitor using a DisplayPort connection at this time.
http://www.pcworld.com/article/2906...u-need-to-know-about-ultrahd-pc-displays.html

So, for instance the MSI 750Ti Windforce needs two HDMI cables to be connected to the 4K monitor. "Digital: 4096 x 2160 (via 2 HDMI)".

http://www.geforce.com/hardware/technology/4k/supported-gpus
 
Last edited:
Just a few facts to start with:
My monitor is not 4k, it's just 2560x1440.
I don't play games or do videos, I just process photos.

You can burn a Linux LIVE-CD or create a Linux Live-USB. You would boot off of it and you would NOT install Linux. Ubuntu and Mint Linux both have Live CD/USB you can download and create, as do a lot of other distros. Linux is a world onto itself, so you may want to stick with a MATE version as it is easier to navigate around. If you know XP you won't have too much problem navigating Linux.
OK if the bottom line is that Linux is able to manage 4K where El Capitan can't, so what? Report to Apple the shortcomings of El Capitan?
With my knowledge and experience of Linux, null, and with my luck in that matter (1), null too, it'll take me days or weeks to have it running. Since I am a complete newbie the learning curve will necessarily be extremely steep.
With the time already hogged by the project I am pretty behind schedule with my other activities (well… my life) and so I am struggling to have stuff done and I can't afford spending a significant amount of time.
I think I'd better forget about making my monitor work on my mobo. I'll try to make sure that there is some chance a GPU like GTX 950 will work with my configuration and if so buy one. If the chance is scant I'll have to consider selling away the gear as it is if I can and consider the whole project was a big mistake and a huge waste of time.

If you're not tech savvy building a Hackintosh could be a little overwhelming. But there are other things just as overwhelmng - working with UEFI, getting SSDs to work correctly, installing and setting up Linux, setting up a Kodi box with repositories, setting up wireless access points and securing it correctly, etc. Heck, I curse a lot when navigating around in Windows 10... My next user name is going to be "Alt-F4"...
The building of the hardware was just a breeze. The installation was pretty tricky because I had missed some important points. OTOH, miraculously, the stuff I was worried about like the FireWire card, the CD reader, the LAN connection, etc., were operational at once. It's just trivial stuff that go wrong.

So, for instance the MSI 750Ti Windforce needs two HDMI cables to be connected to the 4K monitor. "Digital: 4096 x 2160 (via 2 HDMI)".
The inexpensive GTX 750s have no DP port and the ones that do are not significantly less expensive than the GTX 950s. My feeling is that it's more or less obsolete.
I would go for a 950 which is significantly more expensive but still affordable, even though it blows up my initial budget. Anyway my monitor has only one HDMI port.
My monitor works perfectly well on my Mini with a mini-DP to DP cable.

Anyway, kiiroaka, thanks for your help.

Nick

1) "If it wasn't for real bad luck I wouldn't have no luck at all." in Born Under A Bad Sign.
 
Last edited:
Sorry, sneezy, if I occupied some of your thread bandwidth.
Yet it seems the bottom line is that you shouldn't do my mistake: make sure your mobo has a DP port.

OK, another question: Do all the recommended mother boards support the 4k @ 60Hz.
Once again, I do not see that in the specs.

And what was warned to me, I might want to go with a DP as the HDMI 1.4 is not widely available in today's monitors.
For example:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00PC9HFNY/?tag=tonymacx86com-20

It appears that this 4k monitor has only DP connectivity.

Or is it worth it to search for a monitor with HDMI 1.4 connectivity?

Nick
 
Looking at motherboards under recommended CustoMac Budget ATX:
http://www.tonymacx86.com/buyersguide/june/2016#CustoMac_Budget_ATX

None have DP.

So I go to
http://www.tonymacx86.com/buyersguide/june/2016#Motherboards
and look at all the motherboards.
The following have DP:
Gigabyte GA-Z170X-UD5
Gigabyte GA-Z170X-Gaming 6
Gigabyte GA-Z170X-Gaming 5
And many of the ASUS support DP.
ASUS Z170-Premium
ASUS Z170 Pro

and on....

If it supports DP, will it support 4k?
Given that this is my first build, I was hoping to just go with the cookbook install. But none support DP on the recommended systems.

Am I making this too hard on myself?

Should I just go with a 35W processor and a graphic card and skip trying to do the 4K with the processor and MB?
A priority of mine is to be somewhat energy efficient.

It seems that many of the Mac laptops do 4k (with a graphics chip). Surprised it seems so hard to do a desktop with 4k and be energy efficient.

Thanks everyone for your patience!
 
I think the issue for guys like you and I who want to save on the GPU cost and to be energy efficient (in terms of electricity and generated heat) is that most people here take it for granted that a PC must include a GPU, in particular because they all play games.
My conclusion about the reason why 4K doesn't work on HDMI and DVI is that OS X doesn't allow it, period. Apple didn't develop the specific drivers. It allows it only with DP, which is the same as Thunderbolt. On my Mini I had to buy a miniDP to DP cable to have the right resolution.
So now that you found a mobo that has DP port I think you should go for it. If it doesn't work you'll need to do like me: buy a GPU.
Make sure the mobo has four RAM slots and allow 64GB. I saw some that don't.
Nick
 
Last edited:
The inexpensive GTX 750s have no DP port and the ones that do are not significantly less expensive than the GTX 950s.

In my area Fry Electronics has an EVGA GTX750Ti on sale for $99.99 after rebate - with DVI port.
http://www.frys.com/product/8015134?site=sr:SEARCH:MAIN_RSLT_PG
They ship.

Newegg has them for $110: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...24&gclid=CNC3wOq97M0CFQrQfgodJ_8CsA&gclsrc=ds

Maybe you can get the same rebate. Check the EVGA website.

Newegg has at least 9 GTX750Ti boards with a DP output. http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&IsNodeId=1&N=100007709 600050349 600487565

GTX950s are typically ~$175.
 
http://www.tonymacx86.com/buyersguide/june/2016#CustoMac_Budget_ATX

I am going to purchase those on the list above. Instead of the stock motherboard, I am going with the
Gigabyte LGA1151 Intel Z170 ATX DDR4 Motherboards GA-Z170X-UD5


The list of products is:
I5-6400 FC-LGA14C 2.70 Ghz 6 M Processor Cache 4 LGA 1151 BX80662I56400
Gigabyte LGA1151 Intel Z170 ATX DDR4 Motherboards GA-Z170X-UD5
Corsair CS Series, CS650M, 650 Watt (650W),
TP-LINK N900 2.4GHz or 5GHz up to 450Mbps Wireless Dual Band PCI
Samsung 850 EVO - 500GB - 2.5-Inch SATA III Internal SSD (MZ-75E500B/AM)
Crucial 16GB Kit (8GBx2) DDR4 2133 MT/s (PC4-17000) CL15 DR x8 Non-ECC UDIMM 288-Pin Memory
Dell Ultra HD 4K Monitor P2415Q 24-Inch Screen
Corsair Carbide Series Black 300R Mid-Tower Computer Case


Total is $1171.83.

I have to pick a keyboard. I might go with the normal wired Mac keyboard. I love the wireless mouse.
Don't need the Wifi since I have Ethernet at my desk, so I may drop that.
I will also add an internal SATA hard drive.

Any comments?
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top