Apple Previews macOS 11.0 Big Sur - Available Fall 2020

[oklhost]

A bit of topic but anyway interesting:

 

[SuperPolloHV]

It looks like the "Windows 8" by Apple
I think the new processors won't be a trouble for hackintosh... I mean... There are people who had installed OsX's systems to AMD processors... so... I don't know... something will come...

 

[imikejackson]

I doubt Apple will entirely abandon x86 cpu support. AMD still beats Intel by large margin and there's AMD code in macOS so it's possible that Apple will switch from Intel to AMD in the near future for their high end desktops or server platforms.

Um, Tim Cook said the transition is complete by the end of next year in his part of the keynote. They will NOT create a release of macOS 11 whatever that will install on x86 based computers after that time. Tim didn't sugar coat it or talk in abstracts. He talked in absolute terms.

Apple has a supplier relationship with Intel and with only a few years left they are not about to change that. Apple will NEVER release an AMD CPU based mac. Period. Do we have PPC releases of macOS past 10.6? Nope. Because they said they would drop support and they did.

Apple is going to take the next year to scale out their Apple Silicon Design for high core count, or enough cores to beat the current top of the line Mac Pro that is being sold.

The base of macOS is "Darwin" which is open-source. That code will continue to compile on x86 cpus. But without Apples GUI layers you just don't have anything.

 

[imikejackson]

It looks like the "Windows 8" of Apple
I think the new processors won't be a trouble for hackintosh... I mean... There are people who had installed OsX's systems to AMD processors... so... I don't know... something will come...

Apple Silicon is a completely different ISA than x86. Creating a hackintosh with a Ryzen and Intel is straight forward because both support the x86 ISA. For it to happen you would need the following:

Somebody to create a Motherboard that holds an ARM CPU that is a perfect clone of Apple Silicon. While Apple started out with an ARM design they have moved away from a strict ARM implementation putting their own secret stuff into the processor. So unless you some how "acquire" the design for Apple Silicon, then have someone mass produce it onto a motherboard with all of that infrastructure that is needed, no, nothing ".. will come...".

Hackintoshing is dead at the point where Apple stops supporting x86 for a release of Mac OS. That does not mean your machine all of a sudden stops working. It will certainly continue to work. The choice *you* have to make is at what point do you migrate to an Apple Silicon system or a Windows or Linux system. If you don't care about updates or security patches you could in theory stay on your current macOS system for ever. There are people still compiling FireFox to PPC.

My guess is that we have about 5 solid years of macOS releases. Add a few years of direct apple support through security updates and you have 7 years. Of course as intel releases new CPUs *after* Apple stops releasing macOS Intel versions then create a hackintosh based on that new hardware is going to get trickier and trickier.

There may be a few other possibilities in the future but they all involve reverse engineering Apple Silicon ISA and creating an emulator. There are legal issues with that.

 

[SuperPolloHV]

Apple Silicon is a completely different ISA than x86. Creating a hackintosh with a Ryzen and Intel is straight forward because both support the x86 ISA. For it to happen you would need the following:

Somebody to create a Motherboard that holds an ARM CPU that is a perfect clone of Apple Silicon. While Apple started out with an ARM design they have moved away from a strict ARM implementation putting their own secret stuff into the processor. So unless you some how "acquire" the design for Apple Silicon, then have someone mass produce it onto a motherboard with all of that infrastructure that is needed, no, nothing ".. will come...".

Hackintoshing is dead at the point where Apple stops supporting x86 for a release of Mac OS. That does not mean your machine all of a sudden stops working. It will certainly continue to work. The choice *you* have to make is at what point do you migrate to an Apple Silicon system or a Windows or Linux system. If you don't care about updates or security patches you could in theory stay on your current macOS system for ever. There are people still compiling FireFox to PPC.

My guess is that we have about 5 solid years of macOS releases. Add a few years of direct apple support through security updates and you have 7 years. Of course as intel releases new CPUs *after* Apple stops releasing macOS Intel versions then create a hackintosh based on that new hardware is going to get trickier and trickier.

There may be a few other possibilities in the future but they all involve reverse engineering Apple Silicon ISA and creating an emulator. There are legal issues with that.

Well, We'll see... we must wait

 

[Simon70]

....

There are legal issues with that.

I think this last thing you wrote is the real problem and the real obstacle. If Apple has really decided to suppress the Hachintosh community (and I am not very convinced of it, but it is only a very personal thought of an optimist), there will be no way to make new Hackintosh even having all the potential and tools to make them.

 

[thinhvoduc]

tim cook doesn’t know what he is doing

if people are smart , they will not buy another intel mac because that mac will be obsolete soon

they should wait untill apple releases the mac with their silicone cpu, that way that mac will have support for more years compared to the intel based mac

so what this means
apple or should i say mr cook shoot himself on the foot

we can see a decline in apple sales
excellent job mr cook
not only do you destroyed mac os
you also screw your costumers or loyal mac os fans and you also screwed apple company

i think is time for you to go

Of course Tim Cook didn't want to publicly announce the transition to ARM before releasing the first Mac with Apple Silicon. The transition requires all apps to be rebuilt in order to run on both Intel & Apple Silicon... It takes some time to build & test the app (well.. the developers need to hands on the ARM Mac mini first)... And how can Apple or anyone sell a hardware device with zero software? Please don't judge too early...

 

[peterg]

Apple Silicon is a completely different ISA than x86. Creating a hackintosh with a Ryzen and Intel is straight forward because both support the x86 ISA. For it to happen you would need the following:

Somebody to create a Motherboard that holds an ARM CPU that is a perfect clone of Apple Silicon. While Apple started out with an ARM design they have moved away from a strict ARM implementation putting their own secret stuff into the processor. So unless you some how "acquire" the design for Apple Silicon, then have someone mass produce it onto a motherboard with all of that infrastructure that is needed, no, nothing ".. will come...".

Hackintoshing is dead at the point where Apple stops supporting x86 for a release of Mac OS. That does not mean your machine all of a sudden stops working. It will certainly continue to work. The choice *you* have to make is at what point do you migrate to an Apple Silicon system or a Windows or Linux system. If you don't care about updates or security patches you could in theory stay on your current macOS system for ever. There are people still compiling FireFox to PPC.

My guess is that we have about 5 solid years of macOS releases. Add a few years of direct apple support through security updates and you have 7 years. Of course as intel releases new CPUs *after* Apple stops releasing macOS Intel versions then create a hackintosh based on that new hardware is going to get trickier and trickier.

There may be a few other possibilities in the future but they all involve reverse engineering Apple Silicon ISA and creating an emulator. There are legal issues with that.

I mused on this topic a few pages back (post 144), and though I agree with you 100%, there are some questions about just how different, or just how much "secret stuff" Apple is putting into these ARM based CPUs. Do we know? Do we know how different the architectures are?

I think the idea of having a chip manufacturer(s) creating ARM-based PC CPUs for retail or for "DIY PC Builders" is going to happen. We will have ARM architecture options in the near future and that's exciting, not just for our community, but also more generally for those of us who want to build and manage our own hardware.

But I think one of the topics on this thread--what we're talking about--is not just about building our own ARM PCs, we want to be able to manipulate MacOS XI to run on a PC just as we were able to do with OSX. All we can do right now is speculate, right? But I think some of us are holding out hope that our community can investigate and figure out a way to successfully get MacOS XI to run on an (admittedly as-yet un-engineered, un-developed, not-yet-for-sale!) retail ARM chip. I think that should be a goal.

If we end up with DYI ARM hardware, we will have to figure out the gap between what retail chipmakers create with ARM and what Apple creates in its proprietary gear. Then it's a matter of manipulating the OS to fit the "other" ARM processor.

But I laugh as I spell this out because it's all so remote and so far off and so in the realm of fantasy -- we just don't know if it'll be something we can try to manipulate, yet.

But at this point in time, I do think we can muse as to whether it's possible. Will it be possible? Or will the Apple Silicon be so far off of what will eventually be used in retail/DYI ARM chips that we will not/never be able to do what we're doing now?

If it's the latter, then, well, that's kind of depressing. But maybe it won't be, maybe we will figure out solutions.

Do you all remember back in the 90s, a chipmaker called Sonnet made legit G3 and G4 cards that you could use to upgrade your old PPC macs to get OSX working on them? Times have changed, no doubt, and I don't think any of us are holding out hope that some company like this one is the solution to getting macOS XI to work on PC hardware. But the mere thought of going back to the days like this is a bit depressing.

But again, without jumping to conclusions, I think it should be a goal to investigate whether its possible. I've been hackintoshing since 2008, it's a very fun hobby, I created an album of music and a movie on hackintoshes, I'm one who certainly benefited from having Mac Pro level hardware on a hackintosh. I would hate to say goodbye to it all in a couple of years.

 

[cacamaca]

Wow! Unbelievable some of the negative and/or desperate comments in this thread. We can debate this and beat the dead horse until it dies one more time. Nothing changes that Apple moves to Apple Silicon. And nothing changes the fact that we will still be enjoying using CustoMacs for up to the next 7 years and more.

@imikejackson
"Um, Tim Cook said the transition is complete by the end of next year in his part of the keynote. They will NOT create a release of macOS 11 whatever that will install on x86 based computers after that time. Tim didn't sugar coat it or talk in abstracts. He talked in absolute terms."

Of course that makes perfect sense because no one, including Apple, expects a customer who bought a $5,000 Intel iMac or $20,000 Intel Mac Pro today to be able to use it with more than one version of macOS. They expect people who bought a new iMac or Mac Pro today to throw it in the garbage after 1 year.

Here is the fact: I have been aware since last year of the rumour about Apple possibly making their own chips, like so many other people. And I still went and spent over $4,000 to build 3 beautiful CustoMacs listed in the signature. Why? For tons of reasons:

1. My first CustoMacs were build using Snow Leopard. So it was time to upgrade because, despite how beautiful they were still running with Catalina, due to 2nd gen CPU I got to the point where I was not able to change the background in Teams on macOS . It was becoming embarrassing.

2. Intel CustoMacs will be supported by Apple for the next 7 years. More than enough to continue enjoying the Apple experience on a computer; it will be well worth the money spent on the new rigs

3. To some of the folks who have mentioned here that hackintoshing is hard, requires a lot of time, etc. and prefer to go back to Windows I can say that tells me they don't know what they're doing. Hackintoshing has become so easy that it is unbelievable. Try to compare that with the old days in Snow Leopard.

In less than 10 hours since the components of the first new rig were dropped on my porch, I was running Catalina on OpenCore which I have never used before in my life. Yes, that means, assembling the components/building the computer, reading and learning about OpenCore and installing Catalina with all the applications. In the following days I have done some adjustments (USB port limits, OpenCore GUI with OpenCanopy, boot chime, bootstrap). For the other 2 rigs I literally spent only 5 min to get the EFI structure populated by copy/pasting the existing EFI folder and only changing the SN/MLB/SystemUIID and, in one case, the audio layout-id.

I got to the point where I am so excited when a new macOS upgrade is available because it has gotten so boring of just applying updates that are uneventful. The "Automatically keep my Mac up to date" checkbox is enabled on all 3 CustoMacs.

4. To those that want to go back to Windows I say: "Go ahead!". Personally, I have never used a more inefficient OS in my entire life. Nothing integrates as it should, there is no standardization, no rules, every single window looks different, it's a complete chaos on the monitor. And the multiple desktops in Windows 10 it's just a joke. Not mentioning the beautiful experiences with Windows 10 updates over the past year or so.

I have used MS-DOS and Windows since 1990 and it took me only 3 days using OS X (Snow Leopard) to switch over. My current work laptop with Windows 10 catches dust. I do all my office work on macOS even though our company uses Windows equipment. I should thank Microsoft for the fact that their apps work and look better on macOS than on Windows 10.

5. When (and if) the time comes I can't use macOS, Linux will be my first choice. But there are is still a lot of time until then and a LOT of things can happen.

Until then I will continue enjoying using my CustoMacs as much as I can for the next several years knowing that I saved over $13,000 building them . I suggest you do the same

 

[Bustycat]

Come on, guys! The official name with the version number is macOS 11, not macOS XI, MacOS XI, MacOS 11, Mac OS 11, OSX, OS XI, MacOS X 11, Mac OS X 11, ...!