Contribute
Register

Apple Previews macOS 11.0 Big Sur - Available Fall 2020

Status
Not open for further replies.
Joined
Nov 12, 2018
Messages
54
Motherboard
Asus ROG Maximus X Hero Gaming Z370
CPU
i7-8700K
Graphics
RX 570
Mac
  1. MacBook
  2. MacBook Pro
Mobile Phone
  1. iOS
I doubt Apple will entirely abandon x86 cpu support. AMD still beats Intel by large margin and there's AMD code in macOS so it's possible that Apple will switch from Intel to AMD in the near future for their high end desktops or server platforms.

Interesting point that nobody talks about anymore. What's about the AMD code found earlier this year?! :D Maybe fakenews or did anyone here saw this code live?
 
Joined
Nov 27, 2016
Messages
154
Motherboard
HP 8300 Q77
CPU
i5-3570
Graphics
GT710
Mac
  1. iMac
Mobile Phone
  1. Android
This is my 3rd major transition with Apple. I have been through them all. (yes I'm that old).
Only 3? You haven't been through them all! ;)

Apple II -> 68k Mac -> PPC -> Intel for me, so this would be my fourth (and other people might have gone through more.)

For me, each one has gotten easier for the following reasons (in no particular order):

(1) Storage has gotten bigger and faster, and more compatible. Removable storage? Many incompatible floppy disks -> zip disks -> CDs -> thumb drives. Bulk storage? Multi TB HDDs or 1 TB SSDs are under $100.

(2) Applications are more likely to be cross-platform or web based.

(3) Data formats have become more standardized. JPEGs from 20 years ago are still a perfectly valid way to store photos. PDFs should be readable (or translatable) for the foreseeable future, etc.

Basically, no more orphaned 5.25" floppy disks with files by some obscure Apple II program that only exists in virtualization under SheepShaver or the like.

That being said, each transition has some amount of friction and cost, which will vary for each user. I'll wait and see what Apple's offerings look like before deciding what to do. For me, most likely, that's either (again in no particular order): (1) Keep using my Hack (or a newer one) even if updates end; (2) buy a new Mac; (3) switch to Linux.

Time will tell.
 
Joined
Aug 14, 2012
Messages
6
Motherboard
MSI H310M PRO-VDH PLUS
CPU
i3-9100F
Graphics
GT 710
Mac
  1. iMac
  2. MacBook
  3. MacBook Air
  4. MacBook Pro
  5. Mac mini
  6. Mac Pro
Classic Mac
  1. eMac
  2. iBook
  3. iMac
  4. Power Mac
  5. PowerBook
Mobile Phone
  1. Android
  2. iOS
  3. Other
It looks like the "Windows 8" by Apple
I think the new processors won't be a trouble for hackintosh... I mean... There are people who had installed OsX's systems to AMD processors... so... I don't know... something will come...
 
Last edited:
Joined
Oct 24, 2012
Messages
37
Motherboard
ASUS Prime Z370-A
CPU
i7-8700K
Graphics
UHD 630
Mac
  1. MacBook Pro
I doubt Apple will entirely abandon x86 cpu support. AMD still beats Intel by large margin and there's AMD code in macOS so it's possible that Apple will switch from Intel to AMD in the near future for their high end desktops or server platforms.
Um, Tim Cook said the transition is complete by the end of next year in his part of the keynote. They will NOT create a release of macOS 11 whatever that will install on x86 based computers after that time. Tim didn't sugar coat it or talk in abstracts. He talked in absolute terms.

Apple has a supplier relationship with Intel and with only a few years left they are not about to change that. Apple will NEVER release an AMD CPU based mac. Period. Do we have PPC releases of macOS past 10.6? Nope. Because they said they would drop support and they did.

Apple is going to take the next year to scale out their Apple Silicon Design for high core count, or enough cores to beat the current top of the line Mac Pro that is being sold.

The base of macOS is "Darwin" which is open-source. That code will continue to compile on x86 cpus. But without Apples GUI layers you just don't have anything.
 
Joined
Oct 24, 2012
Messages
37
Motherboard
ASUS Prime Z370-A
CPU
i7-8700K
Graphics
UHD 630
Mac
  1. MacBook Pro
It looks like the "Windows 8" of Apple
I think the new processors won't be a trouble for hackintosh... I mean... There are people who had installed OsX's systems to AMD processors... so... I don't know... something will come...
Apple Silicon is a completely different ISA than x86. Creating a hackintosh with a Ryzen and Intel is straight forward because both support the x86 ISA. For it to happen you would need the following:

Somebody to create a Motherboard that holds an ARM CPU that is a perfect clone of Apple Silicon. While Apple started out with an ARM design they have moved away from a strict ARM implementation putting their own secret stuff into the processor. So unless you some how "acquire" the design for Apple Silicon, then have someone mass produce it onto a motherboard with all of that infrastructure that is needed, no, nothing ".. will come...".

Hackintoshing is dead at the point where Apple stops supporting x86 for a release of Mac OS. That does not mean your machine all of a sudden stops working. It will certainly continue to work. The choice *you* have to make is at what point do you migrate to an Apple Silicon system or a Windows or Linux system. If you don't care about updates or security patches you could in theory stay on your current macOS system for ever. There are people still compiling FireFox to PPC.

My guess is that we have about 5 solid years of macOS releases. Add a few years of direct apple support through security updates and you have 7 years. Of course as intel releases new CPUs *after* Apple stops releasing macOS Intel versions then create a hackintosh based on that new hardware is going to get trickier and trickier.

There may be a few other possibilities in the future but they all involve reverse engineering Apple Silicon ISA and creating an emulator. There are legal issues with that.
 
Joined
Aug 14, 2012
Messages
6
Motherboard
MSI H310M PRO-VDH PLUS
CPU
i3-9100F
Graphics
GT 710
Mac
  1. iMac
  2. MacBook
  3. MacBook Air
  4. MacBook Pro
  5. Mac mini
  6. Mac Pro
Classic Mac
  1. eMac
  2. iBook
  3. iMac
  4. Power Mac
  5. PowerBook
Mobile Phone
  1. Android
  2. iOS
  3. Other
Apple Silicon is a completely different ISA than x86. Creating a hackintosh with a Ryzen and Intel is straight forward because both support the x86 ISA. For it to happen you would need the following:

Somebody to create a Motherboard that holds an ARM CPU that is a perfect clone of Apple Silicon. While Apple started out with an ARM design they have moved away from a strict ARM implementation putting their own secret stuff into the processor. So unless you some how "acquire" the design for Apple Silicon, then have someone mass produce it onto a motherboard with all of that infrastructure that is needed, no, nothing ".. will come...".

Hackintoshing is dead at the point where Apple stops supporting x86 for a release of Mac OS. That does not mean your machine all of a sudden stops working. It will certainly continue to work. The choice *you* have to make is at what point do you migrate to an Apple Silicon system or a Windows or Linux system. If you don't care about updates or security patches you could in theory stay on your current macOS system for ever. There are people still compiling FireFox to PPC.

My guess is that we have about 5 solid years of macOS releases. Add a few years of direct apple support through security updates and you have 7 years. Of course as intel releases new CPUs *after* Apple stops releasing macOS Intel versions then create a hackintosh based on that new hardware is going to get trickier and trickier.

There may be a few other possibilities in the future but they all involve reverse engineering Apple Silicon ISA and creating an emulator. There are legal issues with that.
Well, We'll see... we must wait
 
Joined
Jan 23, 2019
Messages
190
Motherboard
ASUS ROG MAXIMUS Z370 HERO X
CPU
i9-9900K
Graphics
Radeon VII
....

There are legal issues with that.

I think this last thing you wrote is the real problem and the real obstacle. If Apple has really decided to suppress the Hachintosh community (and I am not very convinced of it, but it is only a very personal thought of an optimist), there will be no way to make new Hackintosh even having all the potential and tools to make them.
 
Joined
Aug 6, 2016
Messages
9
Motherboard
H170
CPU
i5 6600
Graphics
Vega 64
Mac
  1. iMac
tim cook doesn’t know what he is doing

if people are smart , they will not buy another intel mac because that mac will be obsolete soon

they should wait untill apple releases the mac with their silicone cpu, that way that mac will have support for more years compared to the intel based mac

so what this means
apple or should i say mr cook shoot himself on the foot

we can see a decline in apple sales
excellent job mr cook
not only do you destroyed mac os
you also screw your costumers or loyal mac os fans and you also screwed apple company

i think is time for you to go
Of course Tim Cook didn't want to publicly announce the transition to ARM before releasing the first Mac with Apple Silicon. The transition requires all apps to be rebuilt in order to run on both Intel & Apple Silicon... It takes some time to build & test the app (well.. the developers need to hands on the ARM Mac mini first)... And how can Apple or anyone sell a hardware device with zero software? Please don't judge too early...
 
Joined
Dec 10, 2010
Messages
26
Motherboard
Asus Z390-A as Mac Pro 7,1
CPU
Intel i7 9700-K
Graphics
Radeon RX Vega
Mac
  1. MacBook
Classic Mac
  1. Performa
Apple Silicon is a completely different ISA than x86. Creating a hackintosh with a Ryzen and Intel is straight forward because both support the x86 ISA. For it to happen you would need the following:

Somebody to create a Motherboard that holds an ARM CPU that is a perfect clone of Apple Silicon. While Apple started out with an ARM design they have moved away from a strict ARM implementation putting their own secret stuff into the processor. So unless you some how "acquire" the design for Apple Silicon, then have someone mass produce it onto a motherboard with all of that infrastructure that is needed, no, nothing ".. will come...".

Hackintoshing is dead at the point where Apple stops supporting x86 for a release of Mac OS. That does not mean your machine all of a sudden stops working. It will certainly continue to work. The choice *you* have to make is at what point do you migrate to an Apple Silicon system or a Windows or Linux system. If you don't care about updates or security patches you could in theory stay on your current macOS system for ever. There are people still compiling FireFox to PPC.

My guess is that we have about 5 solid years of macOS releases. Add a few years of direct apple support through security updates and you have 7 years. Of course as intel releases new CPUs *after* Apple stops releasing macOS Intel versions then create a hackintosh based on that new hardware is going to get trickier and trickier.

There may be a few other possibilities in the future but they all involve reverse engineering Apple Silicon ISA and creating an emulator. There are legal issues with that.

I mused on this topic a few pages back (post 144), and though I agree with you 100%, there are some questions about just how different, or just how much "secret stuff" Apple is putting into these ARM based CPUs. Do we know? Do we know how different the architectures are?

I think the idea of having a chip manufacturer(s) creating ARM-based PC CPUs for retail or for "DIY PC Builders" is going to happen. We will have ARM architecture options in the near future and that's exciting, not just for our community, but also more generally for those of us who want to build and manage our own hardware.

But I think one of the topics on this thread--what we're talking about--is not just about building our own ARM PCs, we want to be able to manipulate MacOS XI to run on a PC just as we were able to do with OSX. All we can do right now is speculate, right? But I think some of us are holding out hope that our community can investigate and figure out a way to successfully get MacOS XI to run on an (admittedly as-yet un-engineered, un-developed, not-yet-for-sale!) retail ARM chip. I think that should be a goal.

If we end up with DYI ARM hardware, we will have to figure out the gap between what retail chipmakers create with ARM and what Apple creates in its proprietary gear. Then it's a matter of manipulating the OS to fit the "other" ARM processor.

But I laugh as I spell this out because it's all so remote and so far off and so in the realm of fantasy -- we just don't know if it'll be something we can try to manipulate, yet.

But at this point in time, I do think we can muse as to whether it's possible. Will it be possible? Or will the Apple Silicon be so far off of what will eventually be used in retail/DYI ARM chips that we will not/never be able to do what we're doing now?

If it's the latter, then, well, that's kind of depressing. But maybe it won't be, maybe we will figure out solutions.

Do you all remember back in the 90s, a chipmaker called Sonnet made legit G3 and G4 cards that you could use to upgrade your old PPC macs to get OSX working on them? Times have changed, no doubt, and I don't think any of us are holding out hope that some company like this one is the solution to getting macOS XI to work on PC hardware. But the mere thought of going back to the days like this is a bit depressing.

But again, without jumping to conclusions, I think it should be a goal to investigate whether its possible. I've been hackintoshing since 2008, it's a very fun hobby, I created an album of music and a movie on hackintoshes, I'm one who certainly benefited from having Mac Pro level hardware on a hackintosh. I would hate to say goodbye to it all in a couple of years.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top